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BorusWintersong
January 19th, 2007, 05:43 PM
Like many, I keep reading about how Vanguard is being designed around high end systems and new technology that will last for years no end.

What worries me about this is not the possibility that i will have to upgrade heavily to play it though, I have no issue with upgrading my system every year, but instead something i already faced with EQ2.

So here is my question:

Has Vanguard managed to go for their high tech goals without sacrificing on the artistic department? What about animations? Have they gone for pure motion capture realism or for a more artistic hand animated style?

Let my try to explain where I'm coming from (and note this is my opinion, i am aware there are people that feel different about this.)

I originally saw EQ2 and was exited, all the bumpmaped, pixelshaded screenshots looked amazing, but once i got my hands on the game i felt the art lacking. Seems they placed more emphasis on what the tech was able to do than the art itself. Armor that was extremely reliant on shading and bumpmaps that simply was cardboard without the effects due to lack of artistic textures are one thing that come to mind. I do have heard they have started to add more texturized art to the game in the last few expansions though.

On a similar note i never felt the motion capture animation was touched up for accentuation resulting on rather odd looking animations in many places.

Johaocarl
January 19th, 2007, 06:15 PM
You need see some pics to see it... oh wait, pics aren't like the game playing.

My advice: buy it, use for the one month test, start a raki or wood elf city. Got to wood elf city on top of the tress...

I want to start an orc at launch, but wood elf city make me think seriouslly at be a raki.

LordPazuzu
January 19th, 2007, 06:21 PM
It's been my experience in beta that the animations are a bit choppy but artistically? It's like walking through a Keith Parkinson painting. The textures are wonderful and detailed and the art style is realism crossed with an oil painting.

People who try to tell you that EQ2 and Vanguard look the same have no eye for art.

Darkov
January 20th, 2007, 01:19 AM
If you have the power to get it running on the higher settings the textures and detail is fantastic, especially in some of the cities (Ca'ial Brael, Khal, Bordinar's Cleft, etc), character and mob detail is suprisingly good as well.

However, most animations need a lot of work, all are function and I particularly like the elbow to the face the dreadknight does, but they all look a bit clunky. I would expect though that once time permits these will all get a work over, other than hitching problems when loading new zones, I think this is the biggest asset problem the game has.

Teleri
January 20th, 2007, 08:55 AM
I think managed to go for their high tech goals without sacrificing on the artistic department, yes.

The animations are good I think and they have been getting better over the last year. I see people complaining about them on the beta boards but I find they are normally complaining about animations that are not final.

As far as motion-capture/hand animated… I would say it is in-between. And it is very class dependent… the monks have some sweet eastern animations… the pally have a more western feel.

Teleri

Nikkoli69
January 20th, 2007, 06:17 PM
Hello all,
here's the typical "long time Lurk, first time post" greeting.. :)P

I have been rumaging through areas dealing with Vanguard, I came across the Silky Venom section 41.5 that delt with the Tech types/support circa 12-2005.

Did the Physics get into the game enough that getting a BFG PhysX card - http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.asp?Item=N82E16814143055 is worth the price?

Or is the Physics a "Future Wish" that is not in the game ...

Thanks....
Nikkoli Walksfar
MBE/MCH -- "Dead by Suit's with no brains"
SW:G

Teleri
January 21st, 2007, 07:59 AM
I would not buy a physics card. To me a it would be great in a ‘twitch’ FPS game… so if you play those a lot then give it a go… but I personally don’t think it would be a ‘game changer’ in Vanguard. Not to say that the physics are bad or anything… just not a huge part of the game (from what I have seen).

Johaocarl
January 21st, 2007, 09:23 AM
While the game architeture was made for use dual core, physics cards, SLI, 64 bits, the programs for use them will be implemented later.

Nikkoli69
January 21st, 2007, 11:59 AM
Thanks for the info.



Tootles.....
Nikkoli Walksfar
MBE/MCH -- "Dead by Suit's with no brains"
SW:G

Darkov
January 21st, 2007, 12:34 PM
At some point in the future, (year or two), they plan to upgrade to the Unreal 3 engine, that will be the time to invest in a quality setup, when you know the engine has all the fancy features to make use of your setup.

Johaocarl
January 21st, 2007, 02:03 PM
Yes, for now they are using Unreal 2.5 engine, the first expansion will bring the game to the Unreal 3.0 engine.

evilsofa
January 21st, 2007, 06:29 PM
Upgrading to Unreal Engine 3.0 would allow them to use DirectX 10, but this upgrade would be a very large effort, because they would need to modify the 3.0 engine as heavily as they have modified the 2.5 engine. Sigil never said it would be done for the first expansion; it's much more likely to show up in the second or third expansion.

Regarding the Physx card: Sigil devs commented in 2005 that it would be cool to use the card if the card sold well; Ageia then went a little overenthusiastic and announced that Vanguard would be using the Physx card when in fact Sigil never said it would. Since then, the Physx cards have NOT sold well at all, and Sigil decided to use other methods for physics. Long story short: Vanguard does NOT support the Physx card.

Nikkoli69
January 21st, 2007, 06:47 PM
yeah for Info !
hehehehe and I went on a heyday and researched this http://www.abit-usa.com/products/mb/products.php?categories=1&model=333 as a possible future buy.
:)

Thanks,
Nikkoli Walksfar
MBE/MCH -- "Dead by Suit's with no brains"
SW:G

Darkov
January 22nd, 2007, 06:23 AM
Thing is though, the Unreal 3 engine is much more versatile than the Unreal 2 engine. There are several non-zonal MMOs in developement using the Unreal 3 engine, so the big modification (seamless zones), wouldn't need to be repeated on the new engine. Also a lot of the extra "special effects" are pre-coded in the Unreal 3 engine, like volumnmetric particle effects (sp) ie clouds.

I think it's a bigger deal than Mythic's upgrading of DAoC netimmerse engine, but not as big as it was to modify the Unreal 2 engine.

Hurk
January 22nd, 2007, 10:37 AM
the art and tech is currently a mess. give them 6 months to a year and they should have it all sorted out.

you still see problems like a bright rock in a dark area, (obvious shader problem) sand that glows as bright as the noon sun (obvious tone mapping issues) and so on.

that said, the hardware requirements were very much affected by the last patch. my framerates doubled from 15-30 on high quality to 30-50, and from 20-30 on balanced to 45 sustained.

I use a e6300 2gb ram and a 8800gts.

Nikkoli69
January 22nd, 2007, 07:18 PM
hehehe I am still underpowered to play it...
3gig P4 HT, 5700LE Geforce, 1gig pc3200 dual channel

So yes it may be 6 to 12 months before I can join so it may work out.


Nikkoli Walksfar
MBE/MCH -- "Dead by Suit's with no brains"
SW:G

Hurk
January 23rd, 2007, 09:57 AM
hehehe I am still underpowered to play it...
3gig P4 HT, 5700LE Geforce, 1gig pc3200 dual channel

So yes it may be 6 to 12 months before I can join so it may work out.


Nikkoli Walksfar
MBE/MCH -- "Dead by Suit's with no brains"
SW:G

Nikkoli, your only problem at all is the 5700le card.

that card was only intended for business class machines that would need at most light 3d (like autocad viewers, etc) IT should never had been marketed as a gaming card.

assuming you are still on AGP, you can get a 7600GS, quadruple your frame rates in all games, and still get a year or two out of that system. you will also want to get 2gb memory.

with those upgrades, you should be able to play fine anyplace but in the heavily populated cities.

Nikkoli69
January 23rd, 2007, 07:30 PM
yes, those would be and will be good .... in 6 to 12 months when I can afford it... :)


Nikkoli Walksfar
MBE/MCH -- "Dead by Suit's with no brains"
SW:G

Techguy101
January 24th, 2007, 06:45 PM
In the last week the Sigil team has done HUGE graphics and animation upgrades...I'll post a few links to screen shots I've taken over the last few days. The animations are beautiful, but repetitive, there isn't much variation. The cool thing is, every finishing attack in the game has it's own animation, and some are pretty cool. My paladin has a killing blow animation where he jumps up into the air and swings his axe down hard on the enemy, it looks really cool :)

A sign in Martok (Goblin Starting Area) on high Performance Settings
http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v633/Elte/AllinGoblinspirit.jpg

A Wyvern, Mounted by Aradune (Brad)
http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v633/Elte/ScreenShot_00016.jpg

Aradune Outside New Targonor
http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v633/Elte/ScreenShot_00000.jpg

(A little dark)A griffin above the City of Ahgram on a Griffin
http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v633/Elte/ScreenShot_00009.jpg

One of the Pictures I took to make my sig
http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v633/Elte/ScreenShot_00003.jpg

Me falling from a very high point...my far plane clip is down, thats why it cuts off
http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v633/Elte/ScreenShot_00007.jpg

bigdogchris
January 25th, 2007, 12:09 AM
I have a core 2 duo 6300 and x1950 pro agp card and can play VG on balanced (medium) settings with a high 50+ fps in the wilderness and about 20-25fps in towns. It looks great on balanced. Dropping to the next lower nets about a 10fps boost and does drop stuff like water shading and some textures down and you can start to notice it. Playing on medium/balanced with HDR/Bloom/Tone mapping on, throw 25% atmospheric distortion up and the game looks almost as good as those max graphics ones do.