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View Full Version : Return of the King impressions...I'm surprised at y'all



togashi
December 17th, 2003, 09:22 AM
First off, let me say I'm surprised that it's about 11AM the next day and there's no forum thread started with all the people that went to see it last night. Y'all are letting me down, here. :)

Okay, first let me say that I thought it was a really well put together movie, really well acted, really well produced, and Minas Tirith looked just the way I thought it would, which is really cool. I'll put my griping about the book inconsistencies in a spoiler, since I'm not sure everyone has read the books.

Okay, here comes the bitching:
[spoiler:03efcf73ee]
First off, Sauruman left in Orthanc, and they just find the palantir in the water? Right then, I knew there would be no Scouring. But hey, how long did you want this movie to be?

I don't remember Pippin sneaking up and lighting the beacons in the book, but that made for better film.

I distinctly remember there being another king from the West at Minas Tirith who commanded a legion of horses that wasn't there, as well as Halbarad and the Rangers being absent.

I think they should have shown Denethor with his palantir. It would have lent some understanding as to why he was such a twitchy asshat.

Frodo and Sam never had that fight, why did they put it in?

Why did they have Faramir get almost killed by arrows, when it was his contact with the Nazgul that almost did him in? Did they not want to take the time to show Aragorn as the healer? I think it would have been important to tie the whole kingsfoil thing together.

Witch King looked cool...woulda looked hella cooler with the flaming head from the book.

As a side note, I was so pissed when I saw Gollum go over that cliff...I thought for sure they wouldn't bring him back to bite off Frodo's finger and fall in the lava.

And finally...they returned to the Shire to find it scoured. WTF mate?
[/spoiler:03efcf73ee]

Raven00x
December 17th, 2003, 09:31 AM
[spoiler:c53b86c078]i was pretty miffed abotu the lack of the scouring of the shire myself, but according to the people i went to the movie with, peter jackson didn't like that part from the book so had no intent to include it. Apparently, aragorn, son of arathorn, will have the healing scene with the athelas as a part of the extended footage dvd, but i guess it was removed for time considerations.[/spoiler:c53b86c078]

Erling E.
December 17th, 2003, 09:59 AM
I think Return of the King was great. I had a fabelous time. It's an epic. It's a masterpiece. It's beautiful.

You have to remember this is a cinema version of the books. The DVDs are longer, yeah, but that's not my point. My point is that the makers of these movies have had to make it fit into a theatre format.

I think they did a fantastic job. My eyes was almost constantly wet throughout the movie :-) I loved the vision Arwen got with her "son" and Aragorn. It was like the beautiful vision in The Two Towers, of Aragorn's death, which I think was the most beautiful part of the entire trilogy!

An incredible, epic film.

togashi
December 17th, 2003, 10:17 AM
Yeah, I know...my bitching can be stemmed with one simple question:

Exactly how long did you want this movie to be?

And that vision from the Two Towers of Aragorn's death appeared in the appendices of Return of the King. There was a section devoted to what happened after. Aragorn ended up living for another 100 years, or something.

Erling E.
December 17th, 2003, 10:25 AM
It dosn't really matter how long us fans wanted the movie to be.

A movie simply can't be too long. That's why they have extended editions. If The Return of The King was 5 hours long, many theatres wouldn't have shown it, and a massive audience would never have bothered to see it.

I think what Peter Jackson wanted to do with this trilogy, was to make it more accessible to everyone - not just fans of the book. This has made Tolkiens work much more popular than it ever was, and I think more people are now beginning to read the books as well.

Lirren
December 17th, 2003, 11:13 AM
I was listening to an interview with Dominic Mognahan (Merry) this morning on the radio, and they talked about certain things being cut from RotK, and he said PJ ended up with 5 1/2 hours of film that he had to cut down to 3 1/2 for the theater release, but the entire 5 1/2 should be in the ER DVD.

Pike Tha Blodd
December 17th, 2003, 11:35 AM
its was 4am, i was tired
:P

Keiran
December 17th, 2003, 12:08 PM
I don't mind the minor rewriting of events that happens in the movie trilogy, but I do have something of a problem with the way the characters are portrayed.

In the books, the heroes all come together and unite against evil because they see it as the best path. In the movies, it seems like they help each other purely by accident. Treebeard refuses to help until he is tricked by Merry and Pippin into seeing a wasteland. Theoden, instead of acting on the good advice of Gandalf when he takes his army to Helm's Deep, goes there against Gandalf's wishes. Gandalf's advice is no longer sound, and Theoden is no longer willing to listen to him. I'm not sure why either of those scenes were changed. Faramir sees the lure of the ring and falls prey to the same desire that took his brother, then decides to let Frodo go afterwards? Why did he have to drag him to Osgiliath to make the right choice? He comes out looking the same as his brother, making the wrong choice until he sees clearly, when, unlike his brother, he had the wisdom to make the right choice from the start. Again, was there a need for this?

My real pet peeve is very minor. In the books, Hama was Theoden's doorwarden, and captain of the guard, yet in the movie? He gets mentioned once. Right before getting slain in an ambush by orcs. Really, he was only a minor character, but it strikes me as bad taste to reward his faithful service in the books with an ignoble death on screen.

As I say, I have little trouble with the rewriting of events, I understand some of that must occur to fit it into something people will watch, but it seems to me that they changed the very nature of some of the main characters, which is, I think, an abuse of artistic license.

For what it's worth, the movies are very good as movies. As adaptations of the books, they leave something to be desired. In my experience, Peter Jackson did as good a job as anybody else has done translating a book to a movie, and certainly better than some such as Starship Troopers. Still, the books themselves are so great, that they demand an equally great retelling on screen, rather than just a standard adaptation.

Bombless
December 17th, 2003, 02:23 PM
In a nutshell "Wow.". It took me more than an hour after leaving the theater to recover from tear attacks each time i was thinking / talking about what i had just seen. Of course it doesn't follow the books but i do not care. I've never fully expected PJ to follow the books, and after FotR i knew he wouldn't.

"Best <beep>ing movie i've ever seen!". That's the only thing i could say for about 20 mins. I think it must have been a state of shock or something. And damn i loved it. In fact i'm going back tomorrow :P

Jordayne
December 17th, 2003, 09:53 PM
Well, I love the movie. I love ALL 3 of the movies! I remember when I was about 8 or 9 my mother had a puzzle of Bilbo the Hobbit. He was standing in the cave holding The Ring. I didn't know anything about Tolkein or the books, I just thought it was a funny little character puzzle. I have never read the books, and pretty much didn't know anything about the stories when TFOTR came out. After that first movie I was hooked. But I purposefully kept myself from buying or borrowing any of the books until I had seen all 3 movies, because I wanted to see it from the perspective of someone who hadn't read the books or knew anything of the story. Now that I've seen all of them, I NEED THE BOOKS!! They are currently number one on my Christmas Wish list! Oh please Santa, I've been awfully good this year..... =)

Serresrelic
December 17th, 2003, 11:52 PM
2 words:

[spoiler:12020635df]Undead Army. I wanna be in an undead army when I grow up.[/spoiler:12020635df]

Ok so that was more than 2 words. I can't count.

Dravvan
December 18th, 2003, 05:42 AM
/takes a deep breath;

Oh.

My.

GOD!

I laughed.

I cried.

I saw in total awe of the mass combat scenes.

I stared in wonder at the technological marvel that Peter Jackson has wrought and how *well* everything looked. Shelob was frightening, The Witch-King was scary, Minas Tirith was gorgeous. (note that I'm not giving away any spoilers, just declaiming that things are what they're supposed to be)

As to the story; things had to be changed or it would have killed the film. But as Woody said last year, by itself it stands very well on its own.

And Arwen has (temporarily) lost her place in my heart after watching Eowyn; WOW! I love tough warrior ladies.

I wish the extended DVD was out NOW! *grins happily*

Tovias
December 18th, 2003, 05:55 AM
Okay it's hidden just in case:

[spoiler:dbe9967180]I've read the books several times, but apparantly not the audience I was with. Coranation scene, audience starts to leave, oops there's more. Screen goes white after the elven ship leaves, audience starts to leave, oops theres more. Finally the screen goes black, audience sits on edge of their seats.... "THE END" audience leaves.
Don't hate me for being critical, but even though I've enjoyed the books for years and all three of the films, this one just seemed to drag on in places.[/spoiler:dbe9967180]

Beatroot The Druid
December 18th, 2003, 06:51 AM
I actually saw the "Lord of the Rings: Return of the King" last night when it opened.. And OMFG it was awsome. The end was such a tease.. just when you thought they were going to end the movie right there.. And without giving anything away.. If they had ended it right where it looked like they would.. ppl woulda been pissed.. ehehe .. But they show alot about what happens when they all go home and etc..

But all in all.. I loved the movie.. I also loved that the Dwarf and Elf are still counting how many they kill... But thier is one scene that is gonna make you laugh your head off .. And it is tied into thier counting thing.. eheh.. You'll see..

Final Thought.. GO SEE LORD OF THE RINGS: RETURN OF THE KING!

You will be happy you did..


P.S. It just so happens that the ppl i sat in front of, were all EQ and AD&D players.. So you can imagine the conversations before the movie started.. hehe

Merged topics to keep the LotR Joy in one place. - Nem

Raven00x
December 18th, 2003, 08:18 AM
shelob made me squirm like i never knew i could squirm before...

now, normally, i'm not too big on living spiders (unless they've been prepared and mounted) but a giant fang-bearing, stinger-weilding, two-ton 8-legged bundle of asskick...*shudder*
damn creepy.

Dravvan
December 18th, 2003, 08:23 AM
*grin* Just to let ya know, there's a forum over in the 'other' forum commenting on this movie.

Thanks, tho!

Catila Amano
December 18th, 2003, 11:09 AM
I've read the books several times, but apparantly not the audience I was with. Coranation scene, audience starts to leave, oops there's more. Screen goes white after the elven ship leaves, audience starts to leave, oops theres more. Finally the screen goes black, audience sits on edge of their seats.... "THE END" audience leaves.Since I saw the midnight showing, I was probably with the hard-core fans, and no one left at those instances (although someone next to me voiced his impatience when Sam returned home), but they did all leave when the credits started rolling. I have a tradition of (usually) staying for the whole credits (because I have a sense of affinity for those who put their hard work into making a movie). By the end of the credits, I realized I was the only one left in the theatre. :( (Of course it was almost 4am by that time.)

Personally, I thought the credits were as good as the movie because of the Alan Lee drawings in the background. Alan Lee is such an increidbly skilled, tallented and imaginitive artist! I'm so jealous of his abilities. I hate him! :P

(No, I don't really hate him.)

Zorathenne
December 18th, 2003, 11:52 AM
At least you guys got to see the whole movie *grins*. A few friends of mine and I went to see it yesterday for my birthday and *right* during the most climatic scene the screen goes black.. Then while the sound was still playing, the adverts and little trivia stills that run before the start of the movie start flashing across the screen for a good 10 or so minutes.. And they didn't stop the movie or 'rewind' it back to the part we missed. I'll spare you all the rest of the gory details of peoples reactions and everything afterwards (I poured it all out in my LJ tho hehe). But the whole thing just didn't make for good PR.. So even though I had read the books so many times and was able to at least fill in the blank for that part of the movie, it just wasn't.. the same.. I don't think any of us in the theatre even stayed for the credits to finish.. I do regret it now though hehe..

Raven00x
December 18th, 2003, 12:11 PM
happy birthday zora! ^_^ *makes a note to send out henchmen to get her a gift certificate to whips n' stuff*

Deathbane27
December 19th, 2003, 04:15 AM
I loved it. :) Worth every minute, worth the two year wait.

Can't wait for next November when the extended DVD comes out. YEAH!

I did miss a few of the things that were cut out, but I didn't miss most of it.

The one change in all 3 films I didn't understand right up front was Faramir in The Two Towers, but when they did the sequence explaining the change in the extra features, I understood and agreed with it.

For those who don't have the TTT DVD: They moved Shelob to RotK to preserve actual time accuracy. That left Frodo and Sam with no real obstacle in TTT movie. Faramir was the logical choice (even the actor didn't like the change at first. :p). How could someone trying to prove himself to his father NOT be tempted by the ring? It also added more to the ring being its own character rather than a static object, which I liked.

So, overall, I either like all the changes/omissions or agree with Jackson's reasons for them.

Unfortunately, I didn't stay for the credits. I had to pee. :D But I sat through the credits on the first two DVDs and I'll do the same for RotK.

Zorathenne
December 19th, 2003, 01:07 PM
Aww, thanks boo =) *huggles Raven*

rayfinkle
December 20th, 2003, 01:03 AM
i almost had to scream out that Peter Jackson was an F-tard for :

[spoiler:89779118bf]the scene at the end where frodo and sam are on the spike of rock lava flowing all around them they have a nice touching moment and then bam fade to black. i would have gone to the boothe for my money if credits rolled at that moment[/spoiler:89779118bf]

Ciarin
December 20th, 2003, 01:18 AM
lol, I was thinking the same thing. I was like, "oh man! this better not be over!"

I drank a bunch of water during the movie, and I never had to go use the restroom.

As far as my opinion of the movie, I thought it was pretty good. I wish I could've found out what happened to some of the other characters....

[spoiler:ef85d726b0]Where's saurumon and wormtongue? for example.[/spoiler:ef85d726b0]

Coffee
December 20th, 2003, 12:21 PM
[spoiler:f6c60690ae] If you read the books *clears throat* you will find out what happened to them.[/spoiler:f6c60690ae]

Ciarin
December 20th, 2003, 01:09 PM
If I read the books, I probably wouldn't have liked the movie so much.

I notice that when fans of the book or comic watches a movie about it, they always point out the inconsistancies and don't enjoy it as much.

They always say, "the book is much better".

Besides, I don't read fiction.

Catila Amano
December 22nd, 2003, 03:55 PM
I think that part is slated to be in the EE DVDs.

Naryn
December 22nd, 2003, 04:08 PM
Concerning Saruman and Wormtongue's fate in the books:
[spoiler:44e432c788]Saruman takes over the Shire while the Fellowship is away. This would be the reason that, in the books, Gandalf wants Pippin and Merry to stay behind in the Shire. At the end of the books, the hobbits come home to find an industrialized Shire run by bullies under Saruman's command. This is hinted at in the books when the fellowship finds the finest of the Shire's pipeweed in the flooded ruins of Orthanc. Saruman and Wormtongue are cornered and the hobbits say to let them live. Saruman gives Wormtongue a good kick and Wormtongue knifes him to death. Almost immediately three or so hobbits shoot Wormtongue with their bows, ending his life.[/spoiler:44e432c788]

Edit: Some small fixes. Apologies for any spelling errors and small mistakes, its been about a year since I last read the books.

Remban
December 23rd, 2003, 12:24 AM
The only thing that really stood out to me for being changed in the fight against Shelob besides Sam being left behind is that Shelob is apparentely able to be hurt by Sting on her body, when the book says that no sword, even if made by the best craftsmen the dwarves ever had and wielded by the physically strongest being in middle earth, could ever pierce her hide. The only reason Sting punctured it in the book was she thrust her own wieght down on it as Sam was thrusting up. Otherwise, that fight was exquisetly done and followed the book. And by hurt her I mean that everytime it hit her, she recoiled like it hurt.

Saethori
December 23rd, 2003, 01:38 AM
Good thing for all these spoiler-shields.. I haven't seen the movie yet. *cry* But I want to.

If I'm not mistaken.. does this mean the entirity of the Extended Edition Trilogy will be.. 12 hours long? 6-DVD set? (Well, plus whatever commentary, documentary, extras they stick on the other discs)

I'm seeing a 12-DVD set here. That's scary.

But we know people will buy it. And oh, will they ever buy it.

I still only have the ER of FotR, and the 'normal' version of tTT. *cry* I guess that makes an appropriate ramp though.. I have 2 DVDs of Movie 1, 1 DVD of Movie 2, and 0 DVDs of Movie 3.

Filan Fyretracker
December 23rd, 2003, 01:52 AM
the battle at minas tris(sp, ill never spell that place right) basicly put every other battle scene in other movies to shame, braveheart finally had its wars beaten on the screen atleast in scale and execution. the men with their Trebuchets on the walls and the orces with the troll powered catapaults just owned.